ME2 writer, Chris l'Etoile, on the AI characters and the Reapers

Thanks to an interesting post on the SomethingAwful forums, I found a goldmine of posts on the f13.net forum from Chris "Stormwaltz" l'Etoile, the writer of Legion, EDI and other stuff in Mass Effect 2. He didn't return for Mass Effect 3. Much of it is quite interesting, but also a bit disheartening, considering how much of it that was cast aside later on.

I find this one especially interesting. On the Reaper baby and characterization of the Reapers:

EDIT: Forgot to include this one on AI and emotions:

Man, I bet he really enjoyed what ME3's ending did to his work.

It's a shame he had to leave, as I honestly feel ME3 was a worse game for it. Even Rannoch, which I liked overall, had a very different feel to the Geth compared to what Mass Effect 2 set up.

In addition to grimacing quite a bit while reading this (what they did with EDI was really cringeworthy to me), my next thought was wondering how he felt about what happened to Ashley once he stopped writing her.

EDIT: heres the topic http://forums.f13.net/index.php?topic=21953.0 Skimming while I can at work - there's some comments on the series' general approach to science (admitting they cheat at times but that you basically have to)

LOL, his last line there 'what can ya do'. *sigh* Exactly. I didn't understand Legion's obsession with Shepard either, and I felt like that dialogue went nowhere fast. As a writer, I sympathize with l'Etoile, I mean when someone else fucks up/changes your work, there's a level of rage there that's unique in and of itself, but in the end, you kind of let it go and ignore it, otherwise it just eats at you.

Oh, and you never, EVER again allow someone else to shit in your sandbox again.

*wordless rage*

Heh, I just think it’s awesome that the writer manages to both bash the racism of the organic species and argue that synthetics can’t/won’t have emotions in the same text.

Wow

Thank you for posting this! It is a shame how the writer's creativity was discarded for something that was "cool" and more appealing. I would have loved to see this writer's work come to fruition.

I am actually writing an article that has some relation to this and I would like to use this as an example. Could you provide the link?

I don't have a link per se, as these are all posts from these forums: http://forums.f13.net/index.php

He actually had pretty good explanation for this line of thinking, which I forgot to include in the OP:

Ah, gotcha. I wasn't sure what that website was, but thanks!

Good Catch...


Now I know why the reapers are so obsessed with Shepard... Because someone thought it would be cool... Damn, and think that before the EC I believed in IT.

Blindsnake Out

Kinda surreal that Bioware's great Sci-fi trilogy had about as much thought put into it as the 90s era Clone Saga.

It's tragic really.

You can pick up on the, "someone who gets paid more than me decided otherwise." It is alot like the old saying, "the one that signs my pay cheques." In situations like those there is no middle ground you either die a little inside and go along, or stand your ground (which pretty much equals to getting fired/quitting). The sucky part is by the time you realise you are in that sort of job, the damage has already been done.

It is a bloody shame because it really did seem like he wanted to write real sci-fi. Present new ideas, explore new concepts, and push the boundries of understanding of reader/viewer. But instead he had to work with 5 year old kids who ran around the room going "you know what would be cool... if the sharks had lasers on their heads! Yeah Yeah!" And those were the people that were in charge.

It's okay, BW fooled us all really. The thing is BW used to have good writers, but they were low on the ladder and got vetod by the 'cool kids'. Some left and those that stayed seem to have been marginalised and the 'cool kids' got more room to be 'cool'.

Just being clear, I am using the word 'cool' derogatively

See I don't have a problem with Shepard being the target of exclusive investigation by Legion. After all Shepard was the only one really who kept harping on about the danger of Sovereign, a Repaer, and was doing something about it. Why wouldn't the 'true' Geth wan tto learn more about the man?

Learning more about Shep, yes, absolutely and it falls in line with how l'Etoile wrote - not just Legion but the Geth as well.

It was his(Legion's) strange emotional attachment to Shep. His hero worship, as it were. To find Shep intriguing, to want to know more about what made this organic stand against the rest in the search for the truth, hell stand against the Old Machines with only a small squad to back him/her, that makes sense from a purely logical viewpoint. But to have a 'machine crush', so to speak, that seemed out of character(to me - though to be honest, not enough OOC for my suspension of disbelief to be broken), and it seems from l'Etoile himself it was. FWIW, YMMV.

Speaking of which, EC, Synthesis, EDI : "I am alive".
Anyway, another example of horrible decision making and problems of Bioware. No wonder that ME3 was such a garbage.
Now i wonder, why ME1 was written good. With such revelations, ME1 and DAO looks like an exception.

Because ME1 was a new IP, and they generally aren't regulated as badly by executive meddling or combat over creative control. Same goes for DAO, I assume.

Pretty much.

ME1 and DA:O had the creative writers writing more freely. When the voice from above imposed something on them, they was room for comprimise, and usually they had enough time to make it work or even convince the meddler to back down sometimes.

Meddler: I want cool stuff A.
Person with a Brain: But it won't fit the narrative, but if you let me do this and that to it I can make it work.
Meddler: Sweet!

By ME2 the meddling got higher, the quality writers were still able to get their bit in but they had to surrender a bit to get things through.

Meddler: This is Cool... make it happen.
PwaB: How about it happens this way?
Meddler: NO! It has to be this way, I will let you fill in the blanks but this and that must be in it!

By DA2 you started to have tight schedules, this usually helps the meddler more because it gives lesss time for PwaB to come up with a spin to make it work. Also at this point meddler might fancy himself just as good and straight up writes it in himself (which helps meet the deadlines even better).

By ME3, most PwaB have either left the building or been so marginalised in the creative process they are writing dialogue or filling in spots here or there, and their work is heavily played around with. All the important parts will be handled by those that play ball with the meddlers, and the meddlers will meddle with things to their hearts content.

Or was it because they were (largely) from before the EA acquisition? Without knowledge of who things were before it's hard to say.

Or perhaps both. As you said it is hard to say, but within the corporate culture of EA. Bioware started to have some of its models passed on to it. EA has always been very meddlesome as a publisher, and I am pretty sure they 'promote' yes men inside an acquisition to reinforce their model.

This is also the first time Bioware did a trilogy that had such a huge mass appeal, so it is hard to say just how much meddling was EA and how much was from the few knuckleheads inside of Bioware. One thing for sure, combined, it made for a bad mix.

Good find. This is a sad read. Especially the whole part about how things were changed by the people above him. Looks like there were still people in ME2 who wanted to keep things going in the tradition of the first Mass Effect, but they cast aside for what was "cool." What could have been?