Boycott Poll

I had to vote no because my boycott is very specific.

1. Boycott paying for any ME3 products until ending fixed.

2. Boycott anything made with Casey Hudson and Mac Walters in lead roles until they admit they fucked up on the ending.

I realize some people have issue outside of the ending and while I don't deny they exist it's only the ending that is truly offensive to myself. So I will not punish EA, Bioware, The Dragon Age team or even the ME3 team as a whole for something two people are basically responsible for.

You know, I'm curious to know what the developers under EA think. Are they really being destroyed or are they as part of the conspiracy as EA?

Anyway, I believe for this boycott to really be effective... I think we should consider reaching out to the developers about this. I mean if they're really being stepped on by EA on the neck, I'd think they would want to consider it. I think we should include the developers instead of indirectly harming them. I'm not sure about how the industry works and all but it's just a thought. Criterion's games were formerly published by Atari. They don't need EA. A mass boycott of consumers hand-in-hand with developers against EA? That would be something. The creators and the players together to fight the capitalist corporation! Now, if they're clearly not interested in this mass boycott then the developers are probably being happy under EA and they receive some benefits and bonuses from them.

It's a long shot but look at where we've gone so far. Just a thought.

There is no need for a whole new forum. If you read the mission statement for HTL, I think you'll see that this is the direction of the forum we are in now: http://www.holdtheline.com/threads/mission-statement.39/

The poll is about boycotting EA / Bioware. We've already gotten interest from people who aren't involved in Retake asking about it. If the community decides to do a boycott of either one, I don't see merit in turning people who want to participate away just because they aren't involved in retake, but that's just me.

Also no one has to agree with my personal reasons for supporting the boycott idea. Agree or disagree, we all have our own reasons, I was simply sharing what mine were.

Ah, well then I will do my best to embrace the new direction. Think bigger, as it were. lol. And I agree, people who have never been part of Retake should be more then welcome to hop on board and voice their concerns about the gaming industry. Would be great if the community became a trusted source of information on games and their creators.

So ... here'e a beer. Ice cold and ooooooh so good.

*fistbump*

Also, just a quick thanks to everyone on the thread thus far. Everyone's being amazing at civil debate - I'm very grateful and impressed, and as always extremely proud to hold the line with all of you!

I didn't think of that, makes perfect sense.

Here's the thing.

I would totally support an EA boycott. The thing is, how many of us are really willing to do it? Would the numbers be significant enough to motivate some sort of change?

Because, if they were, I doubt that the boycott would have to go on for much longer.

I'm no economist, but I figure if our actions really hurt EA's pockets, then they would act. Perhaps fast enough, that other developers wouldn't really be at risk. Our intentions would have to be very clear though, as well as our numbers.

While discussion is very civil here, I doubt that it would remain civil in other outlets, where any sort of boycott suggestion would attract the biggest trolls on the internet, from both sides.

So, while I support an EA boycott, and truly believe the best way to vote is with(holding) your money, I don't know how feasible it is to actually pull it off.

But like I said, I'm no economist. So perhaps I am overlooking some huge variables.

I agree that while Boycotting is a good idea, I simply don't see how we could get the numbers to do it. In the end, only the few of us boycotting would lose. Also, as much as I'd like to stick it to EA, in order to do that we would have to it would end up hurting a bunch of other companies that don't deserve it. That is just as bad as us getting lied to and ripped off.


With that said, if we somehow could get the numbers, a short (say 2 month) boycott could be in order for Bioware. One that shows we mean business, but that doesn't seriously hurt them. Show them that we are in this to win it, but don't want to bankrupt them. I don't think we should be out for revenge, rather just to right several wrongs and get Bioware back on the right track. Assertive, not agressive.


Anyways that's my 2 cents

To the "without enough people to do this it wouldnt make a difference" point, again I bring up how we dropped their stock by 2.6 points without even TRYING in only a couple of weeks. I think we could make a difference, no matter how many people there are doing it. And to that end, I think we also could make this big, IF it's something we decided to do.
just my two bits <3

Appreciate you putting this together kihten. While some found this Poll limiting in choices, I thought it brought the choices down to a much easier and straight forward level. I would throw in my meager vote behind a boycott of EA in and of itself. The simple fact of the matter is this entire debacle could have been handled with one decision by the Management Team at EA, specifically between the Doctors and the other men and women at the top of the totem pole.

One phone call is all it would have taken to get Hudson and Walters to rectify their mistake and, if they would have refused on "artistic" principles (which, frankly, sounded like an EA stance from the start to simply keep them from admitting that the unresolved/open ended conclusion was done for the sake of building off the IP, i.e. an MMO = Money) replacing them with a new Creative Director and Lead Writer would have been simple enough. Despite his departure and the dubious nature of it I'm sure Drew Karpyshyn would have been happy enough to come back in if only to save the Universe he helped create.

Boycotting BioWare, specifically, is flawed if only for the fact they aren't really in control anymore. The choice to fix the ME3 error rests with EA and, as such, making the publisher feel the sting of monetary loss would go farther then targeting BioWare alone. This is, of course, merely my viewpoint.

Do you have any idea what somebody getting started in the games industry would sacrifice just to HAVE Bioware on their resume?

I cannot mourn the current positions of anybody working at Bioware. Even if the studio tanks -- which it wont -- those people likely have bright futures.

Boycotting either EA or Bioware before the Extended Cut comes out defeats the purpose. IMO any decision on that should wait until after the Extended Cut.

once the DLC comes out, our voices wont matter because it will be over and done with....? we can still fight but we'll have lost quite a foothold & an opportunity to influence the DLC to make it what we want it to be...

I said on a another thread how i have passed my copy of MassE3 on to four of my friends to try , instead of buying their own copy . Just that alone has taken £120 from EA . Not much i know but times that by how many of my friends friends spread the word . And then times it by other members on here . Just a example but you guys helped raise over $80000 , thats amazing from a "minority" .

Voted no.

Partially for the reasons others mentioned. But also because......well......I don't think anything will change currently. A boycott would be seen as a reaction to a horrible advertisement which mis-characterized the retake movement. Normally, the response would be to slightly escalate by releasing a counter-advertisement mocking the original advertisement. A boycott seems just too extreme of a response. I could have seen one after the PAX announcement, as it would be a strong statement about them refusing to consider what retake had to say. Now? I just don't see it.

Still, there are many good reasons to boycott. And believe me, I am totally about it. My father worked blue collar jobs, often up to 100 hour work weeks. He was threatened with being fired if he complained and a lot of other truly horrible things that just aren't appropriate for public discussion. So I sympathize with boycotting EA because they are horrible. Heck, I was honestly moved by many of you who talked about reasons why a boycott should happen.

I voted my opinion. And here's the ironic thing....I already don't play online play and will not have any disposable income for about a year so so....so there is almost no way I will give BioWare any money anyways! So, no matter how the group votes, I'm already boycotting. Unintentionally, sure. But still doing it

With respect, I think you're missing the fact that not everyone in the Movement is happy with the Extended Cut; those, such as myself, see it as an empty "token of goodwill" that, by their own admission, will do nothing to correct the mistakes the ending makes. The whole point of it is to "clarify" the ending via extended cutscenes. Retake doesn't need the ending clarified. We know it's a complete failure of writing and storytelling. What we want is a correction of said ending, not more cut scenes. As such, waiting for BioWare to release EA's "peace offering" will only give the impression that we will settle for any crumb they doll out as opposed to standing strong against what we have wanted from the start. A New Ending.

this is a dumb idea. why? you might manage the garner the support of boycotting ea/bioware products here on htl. But elsewhere, you would have a hard time doing so. Thus, this whole boycott will result in a minscule percentage in the overall sales chart.

Also, I believe you should treat video games more adult like. If you were upset a certain film studio, or book publisher was doing harm to your favorite franchise, would you automatically boycott any future film, or book that you might be interested from that same studio?

I wouldn't. I'm a gamer, I like to experience new experiences in the video game medium. I love Dead Space, and Visercal is owned by EA. Does that mean I have to stop enjoying Dead Space because of that? No. You guys need to learn how to move on.

I must ask. Are you guys gamers? Or are you guys just soley mass effect fans?

Just my 2 cents.

A boycott against a future game would make one heck of a statement. I'm not completely convinced of its success......I remember trying to explain to someone the basic idea.

(# of games) x (projected profit per game for EA) x (number of retake member) = lost profit for EA. So assuming the following

4 game boycott x $15 per game profit x 70,000 people = $4.2 million profit not earned. But that is assuming that matters to EA and BioWare. Yeah, sounds weird. But they are moving towards the decentralized MMO business model which sells very small services and products for little money. That is normally marketed towards casual gamers rather than hardcore gamers. It creates a steady flow of money over an extended period of time and is proven to be a success. A successful boycott would require reaching a very wide gaming audience and try to convince a good sized population to stop spending money on it. That.....I don't know if it is possible.

The boycott would have to be very, very specific and formed in a way which no other boycott has been formed before in order to be effective.

Both. Not mutually exclusive. Can take action against part and still support whole. For example, there are boycotts against certain products of food. Does that mean when boycotting against product, boy-cotters stop eating? No. While are entitled to opinion...would strongly recommend looking at history of boycotts to understand effectiveness and purpose.